Magic - Revision history

Zadammac: /* Magic as Understood By Everyone Else */

2024-05-10T14:52:09Z

Magic as Understood By Everyone Else

← Older revision		Revision as of 14:52, 10 May 2024
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	* '''[[Bastonia]]''' - Few understand much of anything about magic at all, nor would want to be seen being obviously curious about it. While religious practitioners associated with the [[Church of Bastonia]] and [[Scholarly Order of the Azurejay \| a few chivalric orders]] often get a pass, especially if their peity aligns with their practice, most independent practitioners of magic would be seen as convenient town witches at best, or potentially-dangerous occultists working with [[the Enemy]] to bring about the end of history at worst. Magic items are best thought of as blessed relics or lucky charms; overthinking it is a good way to get your fancy new sword confiscated.		* '''[[Bastonia]]''' - Few understand much of anything about magic at all, nor would want to be seen being obviously curious about it. While religious practitioners associated with the [[Church of Bastonia]] and [[Scholarly Order of the Azurejay \| a few chivalric orders]] often get a pass, especially if their peity aligns with their practice, most independent practitioners of magic would be seen as convenient town witches at best, or potentially-dangerous occultists working with [[the Enemy]] to bring about the end of history at worst. Magic items are best thought of as blessed relics or lucky charms; overthinking it is a good way to get your fancy new sword confiscated.
	* '''[[Atarlie Empire]]''' - Magic is, to an extent, in the blood of every Elf, and since elves make up the majority of imperial citizens and more or less the totality of the imperial government, magic is much more common and accepted here. Most people know at least a little about [[Ars Magica]] (to varying degrees of accuracy - think how most people know "a little bit" about computing today) and are comfortable with spellcasting happening around them and the frequent use of magic items.		* '''[[Atarlie Empire]]''' - Magic is, to an extent, in the blood of every Elf, and since elves make up the majority of imperial citizens and more or less the totality of the imperial government, magic is much more common and accepted here. Most people know at least a little about [[Ars Magica]] (to varying degrees of accuracy - think how most people know "a little bit" about computing today) and are comfortable with spellcasting happening around them and the frequent use of magic items.
	* '''[[~~The~~ Hearthlands]]''' - As a protectorate of the Atarlie Empire, much the same.		* '''The [[Hearthlands]]''' - As a protectorate of the Atarlie Empire, much the same.
	* '''[[~~The~~ Lordless Lands]]''' - Though largely empty of people, not short at all on magical phenomena and beasts, which are seen as just a routine part of mundane reality by the people who practice there and the systems of magic that have sprung up as a result. Practicioners of either the [[Secrets of Nature]] or [[Orcish Shamanism]] are usually profoundly respected members of their communities in this region.		* '''The [[Lordless Lands]]''' - Though largely empty of people, not short at all on magical phenomena and beasts, which are seen as just a routine part of mundane reality by the people who practice there and the systems of magic that have sprung up as a result. Practicioners of either the [[Secrets of Nature]] or [[Orcish Shamanism]] are usually profoundly respected members of their communities in this region.
	* '''[[~~The~~ Shimmering Shore]]''' - Especially around Baghar, magic is very well known and understood, even by the common folk, to a degree not seen in the rest of Wisteria. However, by the time of the [[Great Rift]] attitudes have begun to change as martial uses of magic become their most pressing use-case. Some blame the misues of the [[Way of the Elements]] for the Great Rift in the first place - others hold that the use of magic is the only way to stem the disaster that has ravaged the region.		* '''The [[Shimmering Shore]]''' - Especially around Baghar, magic is very well known and understood, even by the common folk, to a degree not seen in the rest of Wisteria. However, by the time of the [[Great Rift]] attitudes have begun to change as martial uses of magic become their most pressing use-case. Some blame the misues of the [[Way of the Elements]] for the Great Rift in the first place - others hold that the use of magic is the only way to stem the disaster that has ravaged the region.

	All of these locations should have relatively few characters capable of casting spells or holding forth as experts on any one System of Magic. Of those parts of the world where magic is the most common, they would be the [[Shimmering Shore]] and the [[Atarlie Empire]].		All of these locations should have relatively few characters capable of casting spells or holding forth as experts on any one System of Magic. Of those parts of the world where magic is the most common, they would be the [[Shimmering Shore]] and the [[Atarlie Empire]].

Zadammac at 14:51, 10 May 2024

2024-05-10T14:51:25Z

← Older revision		Revision as of 14:51, 10 May 2024
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	# The in-universe understanding of magic of high-expertise practitioners of its diegetic Systems of Magic, and;		# The in-universe understanding of magic of high-expertise practitioners of its diegetic Systems of Magic, and;
	# The in-universe understanding of magic of non-scholars in various portions of [[Wisteria]].		# The in-universe understanding of magic of non-scholars in various portions of [[Wisteria]].

			Above all, magic in this setting needs to feel like magic. Even among [[Ars Magica]] users, it should feel less like an engineering problem in the modern era and more like a matter for weeks of careful research and perhaps-unfortunate testing to learn even a single spell. The creation of any magical item should be a noteworthy occurrence, alchemy should be more magic than chemistry, and it should be perfectly valid - indeed preferable - for a magical phenomenon to feel impossible or just straight up magical rather than feeling like the magical equivalent of dialing your stargate. In short, the system of magic, for all attempts to harden it, is soft.

			Additionally, spellcasters should be relatively rare, and lower-level where they occur - players being the obvious exception. Instead, rely on things like powerful artefacts or divine blessings to insulate NPCs against the effects of higher-level spells where needed, rather than just putting a level 18 archmage at the shoulder of every powerful ruler.

	== Wisterian Magic and TTRPG Magic Systems ==		== Wisterian Magic and TTRPG Magic Systems ==

Zadammac: /* Magic as Understood By Everyone Else */

2024-05-10T14:47:39Z

Magic as Understood By Everyone Else

← Older revision		Revision as of 14:47, 10 May 2024
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	The understanding of magic in a "popular mechanics" sense by the common folk of [[Wisteria]] will vary from region to region, as will the acceptance of the practice. As with the systems of magic pages, reading the various nation pages will give deeper insights into how different kinds of magic are seen in each place.		The understanding of magic in a "popular mechanics" sense by the common folk of [[Wisteria]] will vary from region to region, as will the acceptance of the practice. As with the systems of magic pages, reading the various nation pages will give deeper insights into how different kinds of magic are seen in each place.
	* '''[[Bastonia]''' - Few understand much of anything about magic at all, nor would want to be seen being obviously curious about it. While religious practitioners associated with the [[Church of Bastonia]] and [[Scholarly Order of the Azurejay \| a few chivalric orders]] often get a pass, especially if their peity aligns with their practice, most independent practitioners of magic would be seen as convenient town witches at best, or potentially-dangerous occultists working with [[the Enemy]] to bring about the end of history at worst. Magic items are best thought of as blessed relics or lucky charms; overthinking it is a good way to get your fancy new sword confiscated.		* '''[[Bastonia]]''' - Few understand much of anything about magic at all, nor would want to be seen being obviously curious about it. While religious practitioners associated with the [[Church of Bastonia]] and [[Scholarly Order of the Azurejay \| a few chivalric orders]] often get a pass, especially if their peity aligns with their practice, most independent practitioners of magic would be seen as convenient town witches at best, or potentially-dangerous occultists working with [[the Enemy]] to bring about the end of history at worst. Magic items are best thought of as blessed relics or lucky charms; overthinking it is a good way to get your fancy new sword confiscated.
	* '''[[Atarlie Empire]]''' - Magic is, to an extent, in the blood of every Elf, and since elves make up the majority of imperial citizens and more or less the totality of the imperial government, magic is much more common and accepted here. Most people know at least a little about [[Ars Magica]] (to varying degrees of accuracy - think how most people know "a little bit" about computing today) and are comfortable with spellcasting happening around them and the frequent use of magic items.		* '''[[Atarlie Empire]]''' - Magic is, to an extent, in the blood of every Elf, and since elves make up the majority of imperial citizens and more or less the totality of the imperial government, magic is much more common and accepted here. Most people know at least a little about [[Ars Magica]] (to varying degrees of accuracy - think how most people know "a little bit" about computing today) and are comfortable with spellcasting happening around them and the frequent use of magic items.
	* '''[[The Hearthlands]]''' - As a protectorate of the Atarlie Empire, much the same.		* '''[[The Hearthlands]]''' - As a protectorate of the Atarlie Empire, much the same.
	* '''[[The Lordless Lands]]''' - Though largely empty of people, not short at all on magical phenomena and beasts, which are seen as just a routine part of mundane reality by the people who practice there and the systems of magic that have sprung up as a result. Practicioners of either the [[Secrets of Nature]] or [[Orcish Shamanism]] are usually profoundly respected members of their communities in this region.		* '''[[The Lordless Lands]]''' - Though largely empty of people, not short at all on magical phenomena and beasts, which are seen as just a routine part of mundane reality by the people who practice there and the systems of magic that have sprung up as a result. Practicioners of either the [[Secrets of Nature]] or [[Orcish Shamanism]] are usually profoundly respected members of their communities in this region.
	* '''[[The Shimmering Shore]]''' - Especially around Baghar, magic is very well known and understood, even by the common folk, to a degree not seen in the rest of Wisteria. However, by the time of the [[Great Rift]] attitudes have begun to change as martial uses of magic become their most pressing use-case. Some blame the misues of the [[Way of the Elements]] for the Great Rift in the first place - others hold that the use of magic is the only way to stem the disaster that has ravaged the region.		* '''[[The Shimmering Shore]]''' - Especially around Baghar, magic is very well known and understood, even by the common folk, to a degree not seen in the rest of Wisteria. However, by the time of the [[Great Rift]] attitudes have begun to change as martial uses of magic become their most pressing use-case. Some blame the misues of the [[Way of the Elements]] for the Great Rift in the first place - others hold that the use of magic is the only way to stem the disaster that has ravaged the region.

			All of these locations should have relatively few characters capable of casting spells or holding forth as experts on any one System of Magic. Of those parts of the world where magic is the most common, they would be the [[Shimmering Shore]] and the [[Atarlie Empire]].

Zadammac at 14:46, 10 May 2024

2024-05-10T14:46:13Z

← Older revision		Revision as of 14:46, 10 May 2024
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	~~{{Meta-Analysis}}~~

	'''Magic''' is an overloaded term in any discussion of [[Ahren]], [[Wisteria]], and the peoples and creatures that inhabit them. While some gameplay systems used to play out events in Wisteria may offer more concrete definitions of magic than what we are about to discuss, it's worth noting that they don't necessarily apply diagetically. For the purposes of illustrating these points, let's discuss magic through three sets of lenses:		'''Magic''' is an overloaded term in any discussion of [[Ahren]], [[Wisteria]], and the peoples and creatures that inhabit them. While some gameplay systems used to play out events in Wisteria may offer more concrete definitions of magic than what we are about to discuss, it's worth noting that they don't necessarily apply diagetically. For the purposes of illustrating these points, let's discuss magic through three sets of lenses:
	# The player of a game system in a campaign set in Wisteria;		# The player of a game system in a campaign set in Wisteria;
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	== Wisterian Magic and TTRPG Magic Systems ==		== Wisterian Magic and TTRPG Magic Systems ==
			{{Meta-Analysis}}

	We can think of magic in a very general way by classifying magic as anything that happens "outside of normal". This is a poor definition for games that are magic-forward, like the most popular RPG engines of our time. I would argue that in games like D&D, Pathfinder, and so on, even set in Wisteria, magic is quite normal. A better way to put it would be "magic is anything that happens that cannot be readily explained through scientific means". This is also a poor definition but it gets the general point across. You know what magic is when you see it.		We can think of magic in a very general way by classifying magic as anything that happens "outside of normal". This is a poor definition for games that are magic-forward, like the most popular RPG engines of our time. I would argue that in games like D&D, Pathfinder, and so on, even set in Wisteria, magic is quite normal. A better way to put it would be "magic is anything that happens that cannot be readily explained through scientific means". This is also a poor definition but it gets the general point across. You know what magic is when you see it.

Zadammac: Created page with "{{Meta-Analysis}} '''Magic''' is an overloaded term in any discussion of Ahren, Wisteria, and the peoples and creatures that inhabit them. While some gameplay systems used to play out events in Wisteria may offer more concrete definitions of magic than what we are about to discuss, it's worth noting that they don't necessarily apply diagetically. For the purposes of illustrating these points, let's discuss magic through three sets of lenses: # The player of a ga..."

2024-05-10T14:45:32Z

Created page with "{{Meta-Analysis}} '''Magic''' is an overloaded term in any discussion of Ahren, Wisteria, and the peoples and creatures that inhabit them. While some gameplay systems used to play out events in Wisteria may offer more concrete definitions of magic than what we are about to discuss, it's worth noting that they don't necessarily apply diagetically. For the purposes of illustrating these points, let's discuss magic through three sets of lenses: # The player of a ga..."

New page

{{Meta-Analysis}}

'''Magic''' is an overloaded term in any discussion of [[Ahren]], [[Wisteria]], and the peoples and creatures that inhabit them. While some gameplay systems used to play out events in Wisteria may offer more concrete definitions of magic than what we are about to discuss, it's worth noting that they don't necessarily apply diagetically. For the purposes of illustrating these points, let's discuss magic through three sets of lenses:
# The player of a game system in a campaign set in Wisteria;
# The in-universe understanding of magic of high-expertise practitioners of its diegetic Systems of Magic, and;
# The in-universe understanding of magic of non-scholars in various portions of [[Wisteria]].

== Wisterian Magic and TTRPG Magic Systems ==
We can think of magic in a very general way by classifying magic as anything that happens "outside of normal". This is a poor definition for games that are magic-forward, like the most popular RPG engines of our time. I would argue that in games like D&D, Pathfinder, and so on, even set in Wisteria, magic is quite normal. A better way to put it would be "magic is anything that happens that cannot be readily explained through scientific means". This is also a poor definition but it gets the general point across. You know what magic is when you see it.

Since magic has this funny property of arguably not existing in our world, different RPG systems model magic in different ways. To illustrate my point I've chosen to compare Wisterian magic to magic as it is depicted in Dungeons and Dragons (speaking generally - rules vary heavily between editions and my terms might be outdated now that we're well and truly in the 5e era) and Pathfinder Second Edition (which is different enough from D&D to be worth discussing on its own). I'm also including references to the Tarnished Tale RPG engine's magic system, though that discussion will be rather brief.

Most modern TTRPGs subdivide magic according to its origin in one way or another. Dungeons and Dragons, since at least its third edition, has classified magic as being either Arcane (originating through understanding para-physical forces and manipulating them) or Divine (channeling the fundamental magic of a divine entity or concept) in origin. Pathfinder's second edition expanded on this set, adding Occult and Primal. This took the two origins and split each in half - primal is effectively a subset of divine where the "divine entity" is nature itself, and occult is a subset of Arcane where Arcane is held as more scientifically-oriented and Occult is more slapdash and hackish. This is done similarly through [[Systems of Magic]] in Wisteria, though it's worthwhile to note that the systems of magic are more like "schools of understanding how magic works" and less like the division between Arcane and Divine. [[Ars Magica]] makes such a distinction, but perhaps other schools like [[Orcish Shamanism]] might not. In short, a game set in '''Wisteria''' may not - arguably even should not - have clear lines between "magic as in a wizard did it" and "magic as in the will of the gods".

=== Tarnished Tale TTRPGE ===
In the Tarnished Tale TTRPGE, it is expected that the Wisteria campaign setting will use the core magic rules by treating each of the [[Systems of Magic]] as a skill used to learn and use abilities related to that school.

== Magic as Understood by The Wise ==
While not all of the [[Systems of Magic]] in Wisteria are closed schools of knowledge, the fact remains that only a relative minority of people living on [[Wisteria]] could be considered experts - or even properly trained - in those schools. The schools also disagree - often very fundamentally - on the nature of the magical force or forces that they consider. As a result, even the best mortal mages on [[Wisteria]] almost certainly have an incomplete picture of magical reality. Nothing done metatextually should seek to dispell this or cause direct conflict. They are all right about certain elements of the magical warp and weft, but the simple fact is that mortals are far enough outside of "magic" that they'll never get a good picture of its whole reality. Each system of magic has a page that goes over itself in more detail, but in general summary:
* [[Ars Magica]] (within [[Atarlie Empire]]): "There is a verifiable force of magic called [[Source]] which has existed since time immemorial and which is the essence of things existing. Through various means, this can be manipulated. Source has eight aspects, all fundamental to reality."
* [[Ars Magica]] (within [[Bastonia]]): "There is a verifiable force of magic called [[Source]] which has existed since before history began to be written, and which can be manipulated to impart effects onto the things that exist. Source has eight aspects, all fundamental to reality."
* [[Orcish Shamanism]]: "There is a magical quality that is exhibited in some kinds of being, especially Spirits. By working with that quality or creatures with that quality, especially Spirits, we can leverage magic in the material world."
* [[Secrets of Nature]]: "Source, as the humans and elves call it, has four aspects. This is a law of nature as much as 'thrown things fall' and 'the sun rises and sets' are. Astronomy is the highest of magical arts and astrology is predictive and manipulable."
* [[Way of the Elements]]: "By manipulating the five elemental foundations of all reality, effects that seem unreal can be produced. This is no different from "heating water makes steam". A monk's ki strike, a paladin's divine smite, the raising of the undead and the opening of the [[Great Rift]] are also like this."
* [[Runecrafting]]: "There is an ancient and eldrich quintessence to reality that runs deeper, colder, and older than the foundations of the depths of the earth. These syllables from Before Beginning can be wrought and harnessed; manipulating magic through their utterance by the voice is dangerous and forbidden."

== Magic as Understood By Everyone Else ==
An expert in each of these systems is going to see magic in different ways than experts in other systems and may not agree. Of special note is that it is arguably possible to be a spellcaster or magic user and ''not'' be an expert in '''any''' system of magic - though rare. Priestess-knights capable of invoking divine miracles, poor wanders with supernatural powers that come to them through their bloodline, and wielders of magic items may fall into this camp.

When creating a character that is a non-expert (by education) spellcaster, consider the following question relevant:
* '''Why can my character use magic?''' If your character is religious, their magic may be the source of miracles they prey to their patron(s) for. An otherwise inexpert spellcaster may have invoked an (un)lucky ritual and formed a pact with some other kind of magical being. Someone with magic in their bloodline may not even know it and may find the harder problem in life to be harnessing their powers effectively, rather than working out how to use them.

The understanding of magic in a "popular mechanics" sense by the common folk of [[Wisteria]] will vary from region to region, as will the acceptance of the practice. As with the systems of magic pages, reading the various nation pages will give deeper insights into how different kinds of magic are seen in each place.
* '''[[Bastonia]''' - Few understand much of anything about magic at all, nor would want to be seen being obviously curious about it. While religious practitioners associated with the [[Church of Bastonia]] and [[Scholarly Order of the Azurejay | a few chivalric orders]] often get a pass, especially if their peity aligns with their practice, most independent practitioners of magic would be seen as convenient town witches at best, or potentially-dangerous occultists working with [[the Enemy]] to bring about the end of history at worst. Magic items are best thought of as blessed relics or lucky charms; overthinking it is a good way to get your fancy new sword confiscated.
* '''[[Atarlie Empire]]''' - Magic is, to an extent, in the blood of every Elf, and since elves make up the majority of imperial citizens and more or less the totality of the imperial government, magic is much more common and accepted here. Most people know at least a little about [[Ars Magica]] (to varying degrees of accuracy - think how most people know "a little bit" about computing today) and are comfortable with spellcasting happening around them and the frequent use of magic items.
* '''[[The Hearthlands]]''' - As a protectorate of the Atarlie Empire, much the same.
* '''[[The Lordless Lands]]''' - Though largely empty of people, not short at all on magical phenomena and beasts, which are seen as just a routine part of mundane reality by the people who practice there and the systems of magic that have sprung up as a result. Practicioners of either the [[Secrets of Nature]] or [[Orcish Shamanism]] are usually profoundly respected members of their communities in this region.
* '''[[The Shimmering Shore]]''' - Especially around Baghar, magic is very well known and understood, even by the common folk, to a degree not seen in the rest of Wisteria. However, by the time of the [[Great Rift]] attitudes have begun to change as martial uses of magic become their most pressing use-case. Some blame the misues of the [[Way of the Elements]] for the Great Rift in the first place - others hold that the use of magic is the only way to stem the disaster that has ravaged the region.